All rights and privileges go to ADV for this. I'm copying this word for word. Joe Asakura: The Condor, G-2 Age: 18 Vehicle: Race car Weapon: Feather darts Hobby: Racing his car at the local track. Of Sicilian heritage, tall, strong and very tough, Joe's the prototypical hot-blooded anime hero. He's the troubled loner of the group with enough smoldering anger to qualify as one of those non-polluting energy sources the ISO is so intent on developing. He's also an expert marksman which, when added to his hot-headedness, may explain his normal approach to dealing with the enemy. Joe's first thought is typically, "I'm going to shoot a ( insert name of ammo here) at those bastards right now!" Which is inevitably overruled until Ken decides it's time to " shoot a ( insert name of ammo here) at those bastards". Sometimes, though, it's Joe who has the cool head and stops Ken or one of the others from doing something rash. Unfortunately, Joe's rational moments never seem to coincide with Ken's rational moments, which leads to a lot of conflict between the two primary team members. One sometimes wonders if Dr. Nambu took personality issues into account at all when assembling the Science Ninja Team. On the other hand, perhaps it's because of Joe's own instability that he's able to take the instability of others in stride and act appropriately. When he is not busy shooting missiles at Galactor scum, Joe spends his time at the local race track, where he feels at home. He does not have much more luck with women than Ken does. He makes friends with several race-car driving girls , but there always seem to be Galactor-related complications. Voice Actors Brian Jepson Isao Sasaki Thanks for the warm welcome everyone.

And then they have him come from some place called BC Island, unleashing numerous fanfics to explain the discrepancy. He also has that gun with attachments. Grappling type cable, drill bits, and fits explosives to one end of the cable. But dead on about wanting to shoot missiles at everything.

Originally posted by UnpublishedWriter And then they have him come from some place called BC Island, unleashing numerous fanfics to explain the discrepancy.

Not sure if we really need fanfics to explain the discrepancy. Sicily is autonomous. It is also a very large island surrounded by a bunch of small archipelagos. It is quite possible that BC Island is a small island under the rule of Sicily even though Galactor is pulling the strings on the island. Of course it is also possible that between the time Tatsunuko (sp?) wrote the background that ADV used and the time they wrote episode 81 the switched from using real place names to made up place names, and never corrected the planning sheets.

Given all the other changes they made, it seems plausible that Sicily was intended, then changed, as you said. Probably nobody connected with the project really remembers what happened. It's been too long. I just went with BC Island: close enough to Italy for that to be the language, maybe nominally belonging to Italy, but actually owned and controlled by Galactor (hence the need to keep a low profile).

Great profile, Dragonsbain! As to the difference in characters ... yes, there was that situation called "balance effect", not only between G1 and G2 but it could also be appropriate to take into account the whole group! But, at the end, noone could understand each other better than the Eagle and the Condor did! They were like brothers ... they quarrelled many a time but they were very close (emotionally speaking!)!

Originally posted by gatchamarie Great profile, Dragonsbain! As to the difference in characters ... yes, there was that situation called "balance effect", not only between G1 and G2 but it could also be appropriate to take into account the whole group! But, at the end, noone could understand each other better than the Eagle and the Condor did! They were like brothers ... they quarrelled many a time but they were very close (emotionally speaking!)!

Marie, I think you've hit on why there is Ken/Joe slash out there when there is really no hint of it in the shows, besides the fact that some people out there just prefer to write slash. People see the emotional dynamics in their relationship and just don't understand it, particularly in US culture. Men aren't supposed to be that close unless they are brothers or are in a military unit (this could be why for so long we've had a phobia of gays in the military -- they might misread the signals).

Originally posted by amethyst Marie, I think you've hit on why there is Ken/Joe slash out there when there is really no hint of it in the shows, besides the fact that some people out there just prefer to write slash. People see the emotional dynamics in their relationship and just don't understand it,

You're right, Amethyst! And, I admit that I'm not that very fond of such an interpretation of their relationship since I really don't like to see them from that other point of view, and since their attitude is a reflection of my own as I'm a very emotional person who doesn't like to hide this side of my character from another person! For me, it's important for other people to know that someone cares, and when watching Gatchaman that's one aspect of the many that appealed to me from the very first instant! During the show we see a lot of respect and care between the two characters of the Eagle and the Condor, but nothing really indicates towards anything more intimate, not even their tendency of patting on each other's shoulders or their holding each other's gazes! That was their only type of body contact I can remember ... a brotherly, comforting type of contact which does miracles when someone needs soothing!

Originally posted by amethyst

Originally posted by gatchamarie Great profile, Dragonsbain! As to the difference in characters ... yes, there was that situation called "balance effect", not only between G1 and G2 but it could also be appropriate to take into account the whole group! But, at the end, noone could understand each other better than the Eagle and the Condor did! They were like brothers ... they quarrelled many a time but they were very close (emotionally speaking!)!

Marie, I think you've hit on why there is Ken/Joe slash out there when there is really no hint of it in the shows, besides the fact that some people out there just prefer to write slash. People see the emotional dynamics in their relationship and just don't understand it, particularly in US culture. Men aren't supposed to be that close unless they are brothers or are in a military unit (this could be why for so long we've had a phobia of gays in the military -- they might misread the signals).

That closeness is something I worry about trying to portray to others without making it feel like slash. It is a very fine line that I tread trying to show the close brotherly relationship that I see the two having (which is very different from what North American's see as a brotherly relationships.) It is another reason I stopped writing for so long, because I did not know how to depict that emotional bond I see them having, and making everyone feel comfortable. The result of that was, writing about a time when Mark and Jason are not together or have not developed that connection.

I've always found the Ken/Joe relationship really interesting. One could even make a case, perhaps, that it's the closest relationship on the show. I've never seen anything sexual in it though. I think the counter-balancing they do for each other is a big part of it. I agree that soldiers, isolated (literally or mentally) together and relying on each other in stressful, dangerous, life-and-death situations can develop a closeness not seen in ordinary male-male friendships, or even sibling relationships. They have lots of little moments that amuse me...

'I think so, but what does macaroni and cheese have to do with anything?' (Okay, lame attempt at a Pinky and the Brain moment.)

Originally posted by lborgia88One could even make a case, perhaps, that it's the closest relationship on the show.

I think you are right. While I do read slash (for some reason Ken/Joe works for me; Mark/Jason doesn't), strictly canon I don't see it being sexual, either. Even though shippers want to put Ken and Jun together they keep their distance to some degree and even admit in the episode where Crescent Coral Base is destroyed that they don't know each other very well. It is a sharp contrast to BotP where the relationships are written to be just the opposite. Princess is Mark's stablizer, while Jason is continually challenging him. Joe fills both roles for Ken, he stablizes when it is needed and challenges when it is needed, and backs away when nothing is needed.

Originally posted by amethyst Men aren't supposed to be that close unless they are brothers or are in a military unit (this could be why for so long we've had a phobia of gays in the military -- they might misread the signals).

Until relatively recently, there was no place for women in war or the military. I remember, as an undergrad, listening to a lecture about how the Nazi leadership promoted a culture in WWII Germany that exalted the relationship between valiant comrade-soldiers in war as the most noble, the most beautiful etc. etc. in a manner a bit akin to ancient Greece (google "Arno Breker sculpture") but at the same time, there was much worrying and hand-wringing as well that they might turn all their soldiers gay -they didn't want them that close, apparently! Different now, of course. I was skyping with my brother recently (he's currently at a military base in Kandahar) and he was telling me that there are 20 women in his barracks. The communal bathrooms are co-ed (though not the showers!) and he was saying that he still hasn't gotten used to seeing in the mirror female feet with painted toenails below the bathroom stall doors while he's trying to shave his face in the morning. He says that the co-ed situation hasn't led to any problems -though he also pointed out that the base is "dry" (no booze) and that that probably helps!

Originally posted by lborgia88 Different now, of course. I was skyping with my brother recently (he's currently at a military base in Kandahar) and he was telling me that there are 20 women in his barracks. The communal bathrooms are co-ed (though not the showers!) and he was saying that he still hasn't gotten used to seeing in the mirror female feet with painted toenails below the bathroom stall doors while he's trying to shave his face in the morning.

Twenty years ago, my brother had a female drill sergeant for basic training. She was five feet tall, and he's over 6, and she scared him and the rest of his training platoon. But she was good, the platoon won honors at graduation.

Originally posted by clouddancer That closeness is something I worry about trying to portray to others without making it feel like slash. It is a very fine line that I tread trying to show the close brotherly relationship that I see the two having (which is very different from what North American's see as a brotherly relationships.)

Again, this doesn't worry me at all as, for me, it's something natural! I also think that Ken/Joe's brotherly relationship is one thing I find easy to write about and in which I didn't find anything strange from the very start of my watching the series! But, maybe it's also a cultural thing, as you're saying!

I think you are correct there Marie. From what I have read, and feel free to correct me if I got it wrong, but the mediterranean brotherly relationship appears to be much closer emotionally and physically. I have read about brothers hugging, holding each other, physically comforting each other. Where as here in North America the relationship is very much hands off, maybe a handshake upon greeting but that is it.

Well ... there's a limit to the "physically comforting" but, yes ... not only between brothers or sisters (at least, when a good relationship exists, since you could also find those cases where brothers or sisters do not go along so well with each other!), but also between the best of friends! We tend to hug each other, especially when we meet after a long time, and kiss cheeks (always the upper ones, to be clear!!) when we have to leave! Speaking also for myself, I find it better to hug someone during a sad moment instead of showing my sorrow towards that someone with futile, unwanted to be listened to words! A squeeze of the arm or hand is a good way to show reassurance, and so on! But then, again, it depends on how much you're familiar with that other person, the level of shyness, and how much you're comfortable in his/her presence! I, for example, don't go friendly touching or kissing every person I meet or run into for the first time! But, you can also find people who kiss each other's cheeks by habit, or for no reason, even if they're not so much acquainted with each other ... the ones we call "snobs" or who love to give kisses of betrayal ... so beware!!!

That sounds like a nicer way to live, gatchamarie, in a lot of ways. They do the cheek-kissing in Quebec too, as a pretty standard form of greeting and parting. Coming from the much more aloof "no touching! no kissing!" culture of Nova Scotia (or perhaps English Canada in general) it was something a strange transition for me when I started university in Montreal, years ago! Got used to it though. There's a really funny book called "The Anglo Guide to Survival in Quebec" that has whole chapters on the "cultural' differences. By my last year though, I could be at some academic function, glass of wine in hand, kiss-kissing with the best of them, even the profs! But then in grad school in Ohio, there were two other history grad students, both Greek -those guys would routinely get into arguments and be practically screaming at each other, arms waving, and then twenty minutes later one would just say to the other "Wanna go get lunch?" and off they'd go to the student union, best friends. Never did quite get used to that...

Originally posted by amethyst Even though shippers want to put Ken and Jun together they keep their distance to some degree and even admit in the episode where Crescent Coral Base is destroyed that they don't know each other very well. It is a sharp contrast to BotP where the relationships are written to be just the opposite. Princess is Mark's stablizer, while Jason is continually challenging him. Joe fills both roles for Ken, he stablizes when it is needed and challenges when it is needed, and backs away when nothing is needed.

Originally posted by amethyst She was five feet tall, and he's over 6, and she scared him and the rest of his training platoon.

Cool! Writing in the very early '70s, I suppose the Gatch writers had lots of precedents for the male-male "comrades-in-war/brothers" kind of relationship for Ken and Joe. But there wouldn't have been so much to draw on for a similar relationship for Ken and Jun, as romance isn't supposed to be happening "within the ranks" as traditionally, women weren't there. I could see how Ken might always feel cautious or inhibited around Jun for fear of showing too much and "crossing a line," -a line he doesn't have to worry about with Joe as they would never cross into romance! I've always sort of thought that's why Ken smacks Jun at the end of the jigokillers episode -because the feelings are there, but he feels he has to repress them. With Joe, he wouldn't necessarily have to, and as a result, they can have the sort of heart-to-heart bonding that you see in episode 78.

Originally posted by lborgia88 But then in grad school in Ohio, there were two other history grad students, both Greek -those guys would routinely get into arguments and be practically screaming at each other, arms waving, and then twenty minutes later one would just say to the other "Wanna go get lunch?" and off they'd go to the student union, best friends. Never did quite get used to that...

Ah, yes ... the Greeks are renowned for their exuberance in showing their emotions! I remember being in Greece, when I was very young, and feeling almost guilty in the locals' place when we went at restaurants, them ending every dinner smashing plates in order to show their happiness of having had us there!!

Originally posted by lborgia88 But then in grad school in Ohio, there were two other history grad students, both Greek -those guys would routinely get into arguments and be practically screaming at each other, arms waving, and then twenty minutes later one would just say to the other "Wanna go get lunch?" and off they'd go to the student union, best friends. Never did quite get used to that...

I wonder if that is a European thing or just a guy thing in general? Here when girls fight, or a girl fights with a guy, it can last for days or weeks. But I've noticed, even here guys get over pretty quickly. In fact, in many situations a guys best friend can also be his fiercest rival: Think of guys who play competitive sports but end up on opposite teams. They'll beat the crap out of each other during the game, but share a drink after wards. Another example is Gen. Hal Moore (who wrote the book for Mel Gibson's movie We Were Soldiers), he later became close friends with his Vietnamese counterpart; yet in the early 1960's they would have killed each other if it meant protecting their own men.

Originally posted by amethyst I wonder if that is a European thing or just a guy thing in general? Here when girls fight, or a girl fights with a guy, it can last for days or weeks. But I've noticed, even here guys get over pretty quickly.

I do suspect it is a guy thing. Even teaching grade one I have said I would much rather teach boys than girls, because boys will fight /hit /push /punch each other and the matter is over with. For girls they get all catty and the fight or situation can go on for weeks and weeks. In some ways it is the girl gangs that are worse than the boy gangs on the playground.

Originally posted by clouddancer In some ways it is the girl gangs that are worse than the boy gangs on the playground.

I've taught gang members. The worst are the Hispanics (particularly the girls). The sweetest (yeah, seems like a weird word to use when discussing gangs) are the African-American males. Not really sure why that is, but when I first noticed it, it struck me odd. Being more familiar with Hispanic culture than African-American, I really expected it to be the opposite. The weirdest is watching the male-female dynamics. Regardless of gender or race, no matter how bad the guy treats the girl, the girl will fight other girls for him.

Would it help to say that Ken and Joe are not your ordinary soldiers, they are ninjas? I doubt any of them has had what we would regard as formal millitary training. (But Mark was a Space cadet) They are trained to work in a small, very close group

True, they're ninjas, but I tend to think of that as a variant of "soldiers," albeit a more elite and certainly much more secretive kind. I've generally assumed that Dr. Nambu oversaw their training (though probably by utilizing expert instructors as required, and it's stated in Gatch II that Ken did attend a flight academy, but left before graduating) and that it would have been something akin to "basic training" with the rigors and discipline that that entails, followed by specialized combat, weapons, tactical, demolition, aviation, driving etc. skills. Not too different from the military, though in a quite different setting, and in fewer numbers (and with them being much younger than normal soldiers!) Considering their young ages, they must have had to learn a LOT in a relatively short amount of time. Probably wasn't often very much fun, really...

Originally posted by clouddancer because boys will fight /hit /push /punch each other and the matter is over with. For girls they get all catty and the fight or situation can go on for weeks and weeks. In some ways it is the girl gangs that are worse than the boy gangs on the playground.

ITA with what you're saying, CD!

Originally posted by lborgia88 True, they're ninjas, but I tend to think of that as a variant of "soldiers," albeit a more elite and certainly much more secretive kind.

That is what I was thinking too, LB. Ninja's in some ways are soldiers. They would have had the disciplined training similar to that of soldiers.

Considering their young ages, they must have had to learn a LOT in a relatively short amount of time. Probably wasn't often very much fun, really...

Which, I think, is one reason many people tend to think, or write, that each member of the team has well above average intelligence. To be able to learn those concepts they were being taught so quickly (or early in life) but then, I guess if you keep practicing something it will become ingrained.

Originally posted by Tengu (But Mark was a Space cadet)

I just love how you phrased that!

Originally posted by amethyst

Originally posted by clouddancer In some ways it is the girl gangs that are worse than the boy gangs on the playground.

I've taught gang members. The worst are the Hispanics (particularly the girls). The sweetest (yeah, seems like a weird word to use when discussing gangs) are the African-American males. Not really sure why that is, but when I first noticed it, it struck me odd. Being more familiar with Hispanic culture than African-American, I really expected it to be the opposite. The weirdest is watching the male-female dynamics. Regardless of gender or race, no matter how bad the guy treats the girl, the girl will fight other girls for him.

That's why domestic disputes are the worst for the police. The guy can be beating the crap out of the woman, but the minute the police take down the guy, the woman is jumping on their backs like a wildcat, hitting them for trying to help her.

I'm not big on slash, but I've read it, both Ken/Joe and Mark/Jason. Like all of you, I haven't noticed anything in either series that gave any indication what so ever of a G1/G2 sexual relationship. I don't mean to offend anyone, but I think there's a faction of gays that have to imply a gay situation exists everywhere. I think every fandom has someone implying it is some fashion.

And that thought led me to the implication Joe/Jason is promiscuous. Again, there's nothing in either series to imply that, yet its all over the fandom.

Well, if G2 is a player, his canon liaisons with enemy women become less bad luck and more chance.

Or perhaps, that the enemy knows his weakness and preys upon it.

Originally posted by Becky Rock I don't mean to offend anyone, but I think there's a faction of gays that have to imply a gay situation exists everywhere.

Would it surprise you to know that most slash [fanfiction] writers are heterosexual females (most fanfiction writers are female). This holds true for both m/m and f/f. Please note that I a say most. No doubt there is at least one person (if not more) on this board that defies my generalization.

This is a great discussion. Where to start? I suppose I should say that I'm from an Air Force family. My Dad is retired and my brother is now serving. So I was raised with that type of discipline. If we got my Dad annoyed he would make us make up our beds till we could get a quarter to bounce off of it. My Dad was never much of a hugger. He has mellowed a lot since we were kids. Now he greets all four of us kids with a big hug and a kiss on the cheek. My Mom was like my Dad. She has mellowed out also. As far as us Yankies, we seem to be a no-touch society. I think it goes back to the fact that the USA was founded by purtians. They were very prudish. That is a shame. When I was working with the boys, almost all of them were touch deprived. It was a big step if any of us could get them just to give us a hug or not flinch or jump when we gave them a pat on the back. I do not know enough about the Japanese social culture of the late 60's - early 70's to comment on the social interactions between males. So I don't know if Ken and Jo's relationship was based on what the creators saw around them. I have an idea that the Science Ninja Team was a world unto itself. Let's ponder a moment. These kids got close because they really couldn't talk about things to anyone else. Who else would understand what they were going through? Ken and Jo were so intertwined that calling them anything less that mirror images or soul mates would be an injustice. It is a shame that a lot of people have to put Ken and Jo into a sexual relationship, in order to understand the depth of their feelings for each other. That might be because the majority of people are repressed emotionally. Please correct me if I'm way off base on any of this. Off to work I go. Have a great day everyone.

Originally posted by Dragonsbain I suppose I should say that I'm from an Air Force family. My Dad is retired and my brother is now serving.

Cool! My dad did a couple of years in the Army and my uncle was Air Force. I have another uncle that was career Navy. Several cousins who served both Navy and Marines. My brother is career Air Force. In fact, he just did what will likely be his last re-enlistment. He's been told its a promotion or retirement after this and he doesn't want the next job (he's in intelligence -- yeah, I love teasing him about that -- and evidently the next job he would have to take is at the Pentagon. I never asked the details, and my info may not be entirely accurate as it is second hand). He's currently out of Travis but doing a TDY in Spain. Where's your brother at? Maybe they've crossed paths along the way.

Originally posted by Dragonsbain As far as us Yankies, we seem to be a no-touch society. I think it goes back to the fact that the USA was founded by purtians. They were very prudish. That is a shame. When I was working with the boys, almost all of them were touch deprived. It was a big step if any of us could get them just to give us a hug or not flinch or jump when we gave them a pat on the back.

I could see that. As a teacher of young children I dislike the way society (and our Union) keep telling us we need to be hands off children. I can understand in some ways why, the child could turn around and claim we are abusing them, but also see it from the other. I mostly see 4-6 year olds who still need a lot of reassurance, a hug or a pat on the back or even sitting in a lap while a book is read does wonders for making a connection with a child. Dragonsbain, I would think working with children who have been abused (or even ones who are in prisons) would be very hard. I complain about the difficulties I have in my "inner city" school, but in my eyes you must have much more strength than I have.

Originally posted by amethyst

Originally posted by Becky Rock I don't mean to offend anyone, but I think there's a faction of gays that have to imply a gay situation exists everywhere.

Would it surprise you to know that most slash [fanfiction] writers are heterosexual females (most fanfiction writers are female). This holds true for both m/m and f/f. Please note that I a say most. No doubt there is at least one person (if not more) on this board that defies my generalization.

Yes, actually that does surprise me. Although it would explain to excessive effemination (is that a word?) of at least one of the pair.

Originally posted by Becky Rock

Originally posted by amethyst

Originally posted by Becky Rock I don't mean to offend anyone, but I think there's a faction of gays that have to imply a gay situation exists everywhere.

Would it surprise you to know that most slash [fanfiction] writers are heterosexual females (most fanfiction writers are female). This holds true for both m/m and f/f. Please note that I a say most. No doubt there is at least one person (if not more) on this board that defies my generalization.

Yes, actually that does surprise me. Although it would explain to excessive effemination (is that a word?) of at least one of the pair.

It also explains the focus on anal sex. Yes, it happens, but many gay men (regardless of their, um, position in the relationship) find it just as uncomfortable as women do. And I'm sorry but when the writer writes about one partner with a huge cock entering the anus of another and makes it sound blissful, you know the writer has not experienced it.

Originally posted by amethyst And I'm sorry but when the writer writes about one partner with a huge cock entering the anus of another and makes it sound blissful, you know the writer has not experienced it.

You've so hit the nail right on it's head, Amethyst!!

Originally posted by clouddancer As a teacher of young children I dislike the way society (and our Union) keep telling us we need to be hands off children. I can understand in some ways why, the child could turn around and claim we are abusing them, but also see it from the other. I mostly see 4-6 year olds who still need a lot of reassurance, a hug or a pat on the back or even sitting in a lap while a book is read does wonders for making a connection with a child.

In my country's public schools there are some rules which are helping to control child abuse at such premises without being too much restrictive, thus leaving space for those signs of affection younger children need during their time spent at school! Being a mother of two children in the age group you're mentioning, CD, that is a 5-year-old and a 6-year-old, I so concord with such rules which aren't so harsh, but which control such a situation since it's a sad truth that the problem does really exist! And, I think that they're working very well, especially in our type of community with a certain culture, and especially with my acknowledging the fact that my kids' respective teachers do play an important role of a second mother for them during the long six, stressful hours per day at school! Teachers cannot accompany children to the rest-rooms by themselves ... they either leave them going there alone, when kids are able to do so, or they'd take the whole class at scheduled intervals, waiting for them, coming out one by one, at the entrance behind closed doors. In fact, schools always request that children have to be well potty trained before being written up at any of them! In the case of very small children, who can have many wet accidents, us parents are called to show up at school instantly, whenever such accidents could occur! (that's one thing why I know I've taken the right decision, from the very beginning, to quit work and be able to be always on call!) So, teachers cannot even change the children's clothes, not even if soiled with wet mud, excessive spillage of drinks, etc ... it's us parents who have to do the job! It's also comforting for us parents to know that there'd be more than one adult person taking care of our children since teachers oftenly have helpers and LSAs by their side the whole time, so chances of abuse from one person are minimalised. This notwithstanding, at class our children aren't deprived of kisses and hugs from their teachers! In fact, my kids always come back home happy, and enthusiastic every day telling me how much kisses and hugs they would have received for their being good, or for their small or big daily achievements! And, I find this very rewarding, whilst resting my mind that the love we like to give our children at home continues to be given to them even elsewhere, especially at such an important place for them as school!

Originally posted by Becky Rock And that thought led me to the implication Joe/Jason is promiscuous. Again, there's nothing in either series to imply that, yet its all over the fandom.

I think a lot of people are very quick to give the Condor all the stereotypical trappings of the "bad boy" cliche whether it be tattoos, smoking, constant partying, mouthing off continuously to figures of authority, never wearing a shirt (I'm looking at you, OAV...) or picking up girls left and right for one night stands. Me, thinking mostly of Joe, I see him as someone who wants a girlfriend and wants to be in love, but with the demanding and very dangerous line of work he's in, might well be in rather a hurry to pull it off, and therefore be somewhat... impulsive. He does, for example, fall for Maya awfully quickly in episode 70.

Hello all, Amethyst: My brother had to finally do what the Air Force wanted. He is now in California taking classes to get his Doctorate. The Air Force has wanted to turn him into an instructor for 8 years now. My brother's name is William G. Sosnowski. He has served all over the place. Bosnia, 2 tours in Iraq, Afghanistan, 6 months in Russia(pilot exchange program),flying UAV's,etc. My father was in Intelligence. I've learned to deal with one strange quirk my Dad has because of this. We would be watching a history type show on TV and something would catch my Dad's interest. He would start laughing or make a comment to the effect that they were full of B.S.. But we couldn't ask why, the secrecy thing. Drove me nuts when I was growing up. I don't know if your brother does it or not.

Originally posted by Dragonsbain Hello all, Amethyst: My brother had to finally do what the Air Force wanted. He is now in California taking classes to get his Doctorate. The Air Force has wanted to turn him into an instructor for 8 years now. My brother's name is William G. Sosnowski. He has served all over the place. Bosnia, 2 tours in Iraq, Afghanistan, 6 months in Russia(pilot exchange program),flying UAV's,etc.

It looks like they could have crossed paths. My brother's name is Mike. His primary job over the years has been briefing and debriefing pilots. He's gone to Korea twice, Afghanistan at least once, Turkey, England, Germany, Italy. He's stationed out of Travis in northern California.

My father was in Intelligence. I've learned to deal with one strange quirk my Dad has because of this. We would be watching a history type show on TV and something would catch my Dad's interest. He would start laughing or make a comment to the effect that they were full of B.S.. But we couldn't ask why, the secrecy thing. Drove me nuts when I was growing up. I don't know if your brother does it or not.

Yeah, Mike does that sometimes. His favorite answer, especially with the kids is "I could tell you, but then, I'd have to kill you." Our family has it's own version of Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Don't Ask Mike what he's doing, because he Don't Tell.

Wow, seems a lot of us here have Air Force ties. My brother's a major in the Canadian Air Force, and currently the deputy squadron commander of the 408 Tactical Helicopter Squadron, currently in Kandahar, Afghanistan. He's done Somalia, Bosnia, Haiti (twice) and this is his second stint in Afghanistan. I talk to him fairly often on Skype. He'll say when he's been flying, but he won't say anything about what he's been doing while flying.

okay, this thread has got me thinking Yes! there is a lot of fics out there about Ken/Joe, I'm sure I'm not the only one who has thought "What if?"...But the truth is (for me) that I'm not...the idear of meeting them is both exiting and dangerous..and I would probably (with my current skill level) not survive...so I read the fics, drool over the pictures and think "Oh to meet someone like that.." and my inner romantic comes out and I thinks up wonderful but unrealistic fantasies.. (truth, someone that intense would push my "too freaky" button) So..we dream up romances for them...were they find someone who understands them....assists them...and in the case of the sexual ones "rocks their world" Society now protects children (I worked for Department of Families for several years, many cases were horrific and gave me nightmares), in some cases we "overprotect them", children need to be children, yet in our need to protect them we sometimes deprive them of honest loving touch, we have a certain level of suspicion if we don't understand anothers culturals way of interacting with eath other. This team grow up with each other, relied on each other for survival, to defeat the enemy... were they isolated from other children their age? had duty drummed into them? would their idear of normal having us running to child protection? I am sure there are others on this board who had challengeing childhoods or have witnessed it...you learn to survive one way or another, you protect yourself often shutting part of youself down and you can choose to do this many ways, you are suspicious of kindness wondering "what's the catch" or have a need to control be forcefull..like Ken or like Joe seek comfort elsewere (alcohol, smoking, anonymous encounters) ..you know something is missing...but having never honestly experienced it..your not sure what it is..so you keep doing what you know ..what you have been trained to, what is familiar. Like a soldier returning from war...there is a period of adjustment...they have been in survival mode for a long time..with others who are going though the same thing..and then they come back into the main stream and are expected to act like everyone else ..no wonder so many re-enlist ...can you image doing this from childhood? In the case of the science ninjas, they were trained from childhood...it would seem normal for them to turn to someone who understands, that they are familiar with, someone who is in their "comfort" zone, and anyone who tried to come between them ...to be dealt with. Part of me is thinking "this isn't health for these people" part of me thinks "these people aren't real" part of me acknowledges that these characters, fics, pictures are an external reflection of what is inside me and that is why certain characters resinate with me (Joe and Ryu) anyway it's got me thinking... I guess, I see , draw, write about them from were I am in my lives or were I want to be...mmmh need to think about this Thanks for the indulgence

Originally posted by littlewolf Like a soldier returning from war...there is a period of adjustment...they have been in survival mode for a long time..with others who are going though the same thing..and then they come back into the main stream and are expected to act like everyone else ..no wonder so many re-enlist ...can you image doing this from childhood?

I've often wondered how Ken, Jun, Ryu and Jinpei felt during the two years that elapsed between the end of the first series and the beginning of Gatch II. One would think that they would cheerfully embrace the chance to lead "normal" lives, as it seems that they were, if not retired then at least put on something akin to "reserve" status. But part of me often thinks that it would have been a jarring transition, as it would be so different from the lives they were accustomed to leading for years, even if those lives involved duty, danger, secrecy, stress etc. I imagine that the transition would have been most difficult for Ken.

Originally posted by littlewolf In the case of the science ninjas, they were trained from childhood...it would seem normal for them to turn to someone who understands, that they are familiar with, someone who is in their "comfort" zone, and anyone who tried to come between them ...to be dealt with.

Yes, and it's interesting that in the show, they don't seem to have any friends at all outside the Team, though occasional childhood friends from their pasts (Koji, Sabu, Alan etc.) turn up (and generally get regarded with suspicion). They really do band very closely together!

Littlewolf, I often wondered how the team dealt with those two years as well. They've lived on adrenalin for at least two years fighting the war. They become addicted to it, adrenlin junkies. That's what was normal for them. Normal for us is geting up, going to a boring 8 hour job, coming home and if you have a family, making and/or eating dinner. Cutting the grass, going to the grocery store, etc. Could they do things that mundane day after day? I'm sure they'd love to try but would hate it.

I agree, I could see them leading a mundane life for a few months, and then eventually needing to get out and participate in some extreme sport just to get the adrenalin moving again.

Hey there, Amethyst: I definitely feel better now.I always thought my Dad was the only person that had a quirk like that. I love that don't ask don't tell line. Iborgia88: Wow! My brother has been a helicopter pilot for about 6 years now. He still flies every week to prevent getting rusty. I wonder if our brothers know each other. Did your brother go to Haiti to help out during the earthquake? My brother took 2 helicopters and his squad of guys and went to New Orleans after Katrina. He was stationed in Florida at the time. Whenever I could talk to Billy he would say something to the following. Hi, Sis. You'll never believe what I did last night. I flew people who don't exist to a place that I can't tell you and they did something you'll never know. But it was awesome! Got to love it.

My brother was in Air Cadets all through high school (not sure if there's a US equivalent, but they're basically more militant and aviation-oriented Boy Scouts, but co-ed) and got his gliders license that way, but didn't seriously start flight training until he finished university in 1988, and after a year or two of jet training, he switched to helicopters. Now he's an "old man" -some of his fellow pilots were barely born when he started out! He hasn't been in Haiti since about 2002... The reason I remember that is that while stationed there, he issued a plea for reading material, both for himself and his companions and I remember scouring used book stores to put together a box of good paperbacks to send down there... I'll ask him if he's ever encountered you brother, though!

Originally posted by lborgia88 My brother was in Air Cadets all through high school (not sure if there's a US equivalent, but they're basically more militant and aviation-oriented Boy Scouts, but co-ed)

I think the closest we might have would be Jr. ROTC, though not all schools have a chapter, mine didn't (I don't think); though my junior and senior year we did have an Academic Decathlon team.

Hey all: Iborgia88: I think the reading material request has been made so many times by my brother, I've lost count. But, even more than that, is sweets. My Mom has sent insane amounts of cookies, cakes and even ceral. My college, the University of Montana, had an ROTC program.

I don't recall my brother ever requesting sweets -or maybe he just didn't request them from me (he knows I'm not much of a cook!) Cadets, in Canada, is a bit different from ROTC in that you can join when you're 12 (though the minimum age was 14 back in my brother's day). http://www.cadets.ca/home-accueil.aspx?LangType=4105