Recalling a discussion about possible extraterrestrial influence on the SNT: I've considered that for my AU. But I'm stuck for how to make it work. Dr. Nambu is human, and so are his parents. Where and how could he have contact with an ET, and why wouldn't the alien play a larger part in the war against Galactor? And how would he explain his purported inventions? Contrary to pop culture claims, inventions have documented histories. Anyone who invents a plane that transforms from propellor-driven to jet-driven has a LOT of explaining to do. Any ideas? (No, Dr. Nambu does NOT have a 'broken' pocket watch. 'Sides, I did that already to Barnabas Collins.) (Anyone else who wants to write a fic could turn Galactor and the ISO -- through the SNT -- into proxies for the alien forces involved. Whoever wins on Earth wins the big war elsewhere. And then someone cheated and wiped out Selectorol.)

Alien abduction? Nambu was abducted as a child the first time and many times over the years. During each abduction, he was educated in their advanced technology. That way, he could develope everything 'on his own'.

Abduction makes it sound unfriendly. I don't think Nambu would cooperate if the aliens were hostile in any way.

Hi all! Perhaps it would help things to go back to the roots of the notion of aliens giving Nambu the transformation technology. Rei Kozumi, the "SF Consultant" for the series, whose job was to make sure the SF elements in the series were at least somewhat plausible, mentioned it in an interview that appeared in "Fantastic TV Collection Vol. 1 - Gatchaman," published in July of 1978. In it, he said: "As a point of scientific consistency, if I was left scratching my head over something, it was none other than the main idea of the transformation. The thing with it was, no matter how you looked at it, it was beyond the level of Earth science on hand in the background. I thought that perhaps good spacemen, who were critical of the "Governor" who ran Gallactor, might have secretly presented Dr. Nambu with the technology, but in the end this never made an appearance. I thought it was a good idea." Once that piece of information got out in print, it quickly became part of the accepted background for the series among fans, mostly because nothing else explained it. This notion was also hinted at in the 3rd volume of the OAVs, with the appearance of the otherworldly "birdman" before the Ninja Team and Nambu at the end of the story. One could postulate that the aliens that helped Nambu came from Planet 013,001 of the Proxima system, the world that destroyed X's homeworld and was his target with the Solar Shift Plan. James

Wow, James. You just keep astounding me with what you know about this series. How you keep track of it all I have no idea .... do you have a computer as a brain?

Originally posted by UnpublishedWriter I've considered that for my AU. But I'm stuck for how to make it work. Dr. Nambu is human, and so are his parents. Where and how could he have contact with an ET, and why wouldn't the alien play a larger part in the war against Galactor? And how would he explain his purported inventions? Contrary to pop culture claims, inventions have documented histories. Anyone who invents a plane that transforms from propellor-driven to jet-driven has a LOT of explaining to do. Any ideas?

I'd probably go with the idea that members of an alien race with superior technology happened to briefly visit Earth (out of curiosity or to help counter-act Leader X) but went on their way very quickly (for mysterious reasons of their own) and that Dr. Nambu, either through his position with the ISO or by sheer luck, did meet with them and was given something that enabled him to develop the "transformation" science. As for explaining it, I suppose Dr. Nambu could have the authority within the ISO to just say "it's TOP SECRET" or maybe he is in fact facing curious demands from other ISO scientists all the time but he's warding them off with excuses and stalling tactics. Or, one could make it such that whatever the aliens gave Dr. Nambu that enables the transformations of the Team's vehicles and uniforms, it was somehow a finite quantity of... something and Dr. Nambu used all of that "something" on the Team's vehicles and uniforms and there simply is no more of it left and he has no idea how to manufacture more of it. Lots of possibilities!

James, what did I miss? I know that Selectol (Selectoral?) disappeared, but I don't recall any mention of other aliens than the Bem (and, obviously, Leader X). Is this in the background notes that never became stories? In the sequel series that followed? And what is the proper spelling of Leader X's homeworld? LB, that would be an abuse of the 'Top Secret' designation. Of course, Nambu could take Director Anderson to see the truth, and the old boy could say, "Right, um, carry on." Then go home, pour himself a couple of stiff ones, and try to forget what he saw. I have toyed with the idea that Yamashima, the inventor of the X1 robot (made of the transforming metal), could have been the one in contact with aliens. Perhaps he was one of Nambu's teachers, or supervised his graduate work. If we keep simply to the Birdstyles, and their apparent characteristics in the series (as opposed to the interpretations that have come out since), I can easily imagine an extension of the researches going on now. The team's clothing is made of a material (say, a version of the carbon sheets or nanotubes that are currently the hot new thing) that changes its appearance when triggered by a specific set of electrical frequencies. Before: 5 kids in numbered T-shirts and various types of pants. After: 5 kids in tights and helmets. It's the damned MACHINES that do us in, every time. Yeah, the 'finite quantity' would explain why the other versions of the team's equipment look like component parts of a larger vehicle, or don't transform. (You DO realize they shot the 'Tree of Life' in the OAV, right? Not the Biblical one, but the one that appears in mythologies from around the world as the source of life itself.) (I do have a warped vision of a darker version of everything. Can anyone pronounce 'Nyarlathotep'? Definitely NOT my AU. No insult intended to HPL.)

Originally posted by lborgia88 Or, one could make it such that whatever the aliens gave Dr. Nambu that enables the transformations of the Team's vehicles and uniforms, it was somehow a finite quantity of... something and Dr. Nambu used all of that "something" on the Team's vehicles and uniforms and there simply is no more of it left and he has no idea how to manufacture more of it.

I like that idea! And it would be consistent with the 2 later series, where the vehicles didn't transform. Okay, the Gatchaspartan sort of did, but not nearly the same way.

The only catch might be explaining where Getz's birdstyle uniform comes from (at the beginning of Gatch II) as Joe's civvies and bracelet are long gone by that point. But, it could be said that Dr. Nambu recycled the "something" from Ken's, Joe's, Jun's and Jinpei's Gatch I vehicles, as they were never seen in Gatch II, to make a new birdstyle. And then, with Getz dead, it's given to Joe again.

Another possibility is that the knowledge itself was temporary, and faded away after Leader X left Earth. The humans didn't need it anymore, or so the aliens thought (or they might have thought the humans understood enough to develop it their own version). Nambu was able to remember enough of it for Gatch II, when he designed the chicken-plane. Then Dr. Pandora shot him in the head to save him from Gel Sadra's little toy, and that was pretty much it for anything except repairing damaged Birdstyle.

Hi all!

James, what did I miss? I know that Selectol (Selectoral?) disappeared, but I don't recall any mention of other aliens than the Bem (and, obviously, Leader X). Is this in the background notes that never became stories? In the sequel series that followed? And what is the proper spelling of Leader X's homeworld?

What you've missed is Gatchaman II. X's entire scheme with the Solar Shift Plan that is a focal point of Gallactor activities throughout the entire series is to send our sun hurling into Planet 013,001 of the Proxima system to avenge their destruction of his homeworld. The proper spelling for Governor X's homeworld depends on which series you're watching. At the end of the first series, the planet is called Selector Star (Phonetically "Serekutoru Sei"). For unknown reasons, starting with the Gatchaman radio drama (And carried on through the Gatchaman movie, Gatchaman II, and Gatchaman Fighter), the name of the planet was changed to Select Star (Phonetically "Serekuto Sei"). Usually people simplify things by referring to it as either Selector or Select, dropping the Star suffix to its name. You can read a bit more regarding X and his background in these threads: Here's to Sosai! and Gatch fighter villains (The info on X appears about six pages into this thread) I hope this helps! James

Originally posted by Transmute Jun Abduction makes it sound unfriendly. I don't think Nambu would cooperate if the aliens were hostile in any way.

Okay. Let's take out the word abduction and replace it with visitied. As long as the aliens were friendly, I think it would work. Nambu is a genius and would have been a smart kid. He could have been more excited by being borrowed for a while than frightened. I queried my 12 year old son about it and he thought it would be cool. A little scary, but cool, especialy if the aliens showed him why they wanted to help the Earth.

Becky, your 12 year old sounds like mine. Mine would probably be pestering them for all the places to hike, camp, canoe, etc. As for the whole Alien technology thing, I think it is plausible, as even Galactor with X's technology can't match the transformation, at least from what I've seen or remember. I don't think Nambu would have a problem using it or hiding the fact that it was alien. After all, no one seemed to know that he had trained five children to be ninjas and created vehicles for them, and by the time it was known, the people who would care were either glad that it had been done or trying to figure out how to defeat them.

He could create his own leaders....Berg Katse, Gel Sadra...maybe he gave up after they failed! Alien technology is a plausible idea on the teams uniforms, the other angle is that Dr. Nambu was considered a genius, and he worked with other people on the same level for years. Who's to say he didn't stumble on the transformation techique in a science lab mishap with. All these years he's been trying to recreate it, he had limited resources in the strange material it created and the field that transforms the civilian machines when exposed to it. Part of the reason they can't be close to others when it happens, or they could get caught in the tranformation field.Lots of holes in that idea...Ebony muses.... To explore that idea I'd have look more into science which ain't my field...but never to late to learn!!!

And then there's the series option: 'It happens; it's necessary to the plot; accept it.' I do feel that Nambu and his scientific cronies would probably be able to discover assorted 'pieces' of the transformation technology, but there would be limits to it. After all, they've only had a short time (compared to the aliens). Vehicles: Joe and Jun, before they get the weapons, have the most plausible vehicles for transformation. The car and motorcycle change shape, but the engines remain largely unchanged. The sticking point would be the belts and chains (see first paragraph). Ken and Jinpei have the least plausible. Ken's plane goes from prop to jet, and Jinpei's buggy goes from purely road-worthy to able to fly (and comes with attachments: it's a rolling multi-tool). That's where the aliens could come in. Or, we just refer to the first paragraph. The aliens need not be from Proxima (or even be a splinter cell from Selector). They could be concerned about the spillover from the conflict. If this nutbar supercomputeralien can be kept from accomplishing its goals, then this section of the universe is safe. I mean, this is a hell of a war, between aliens in TWO DIFFERENT GALAXIES! Yet, the intervening space is not alight with destruction and fleeing masses of ET refugees. Still have to figure a way around a violation of science: Selector (or whatever) is 2 million light-years away. For people on Earth to see its destruction, then it happened 2 million years ago (shortly after Leader X left the planet). Apparently, Leader X's creators didn't find a way around relativity, so he/it was in transit during much of those two million years. They must have been confident in the mission. Then what happened? The last transmission wasn't good, so Leader X started up the Black Hole Operation? A glitch in the program that is Leader X? A glitch is an idea. Perhaps some sabotage. The original idea was Earth as a staging area, its people converted into a force that would invade the Proxima Centauri star system and, even if they didn't conquer, do enough damage to remove the system's inhabitants as a threat to Selector. But the programmers missed something in the code, or the AI that is Leader X was a little too sentient and went bugger-all, or something. The hand-wave in my fics is that Leader X is so damned alien we can't figure out what he/she/it is or wants. That way, we don't have to delve into why a successful covert organization suddenly launches huge mecha at everything, or why Leader X occasionally goes genocidal (although I'll tweak things so the genocidal bits come closer to the end of the series run). There was a plan, it was derailed, and Leader X can't get it back on the rails. (In those posts James linked to were some interesting ideas. The one in which Katse is taken over by his own computer program is rather intriguing. I can only deduce he wasn't a sex-changing mutant in that idea.)

I had a whole culture (In a ficcie I wrote ages ago, one of the first) linked to Earth- their origins began here during the dinosaur age...they were an advanced evolving species that opted to leave Earth for the planet Selector when they realized the planet was about to have a disaster. )When it come to Sosai X and his spieces...he even had a wife...that ahhh was a rocky marriage.... UW- You're very detailed in your back story and AU.

Well, some of those were just ideas. For me, Leader X is so alien that no-one on Earth can really tell what it is (regardless of what Henjinman may have thought), or what it really wants. There was a reason for Leader X taking over Earth. If it wanted merely to destroy it to create a black hole (assuming that was even possible), it probably had the technology for that already. Something went terribly wrong. What happened? That I will leave a mystery. I checked in Wikipedia, and the Andromeda Galaxy IS 2,500,000 light-years from Earth, so the writers had the distance (mostly) right. But can astronomers on Earth make out individual stars? Proxima Centauri is fairly close to Earth, close enough to our Solar System for numerous SF writers to have made it a valid target for human space explorers. It's the third of the three stars of the Centauri system, in addition to Alpha Centauri A and Alpha Centauri B. [Back before some of the newer details came out about that system, it was the 'Alpha Centauri' that the Robinsons tried to reach --- and never did --- on 'Lost in Space'.] Proxima is a flaring red dwarf, so any alien lifeforms would be completely alien. Do the aliens involved have some sort of 'warp drive' to avoid relativity? And if they do, why isn't the space in between active with warfare? And why is Leader X pursuing the conquest of Earth when he/she/it should be well aware that Selector is long gone? Are we to believe there are no useful planets (in terms of resources) between Selector and Earth? Or are these beings so damned alien we'd never understand? Time to break out the grimoires and question the show's creators!

I just read a little further into the Sosai X thread about the team's initial hobbies. Joe as a gardener may not be such a stretch. Peaceful hobby, a great way to get away from it all, and few insoluble problems. Or, he might be the one who provides Morticia Addams with 'Cleopatra'. I can see Berg Katse raising ferocious animals. And being genre-savvy enough to not use them in the obvious ways. Just blow the audience's expectations.

Hi all!

I mean, this is a hell of a war, between aliens in TWO DIFFERENT GALAXIES! Yet, the intervening space is not alight with destruction and fleeing masses of ET refugees.

Do the aliens involved have some sort of 'warp drive' to avoid relativity? And if they do, why isn't the space in between active with warfare?

As we can see from this drawing that was produced for the Gatchaman II Planning, the notion was that the war was fought by using sub-space to bypass the distances between Proxima and Andromeda. From the look of things, this was also the means used by Governor X to travel to Earth. The references X making the Earth into a Black Hole are related to the initial versions of the Gatchaman II Planning, not the events shown at the end of the first series. This later changed into the Solar Shift Plan.

And why is Leader X pursuing the conquest of Earth when he/she/it should be well aware that Selector is long gone? Are we to believe there are no useful planets (in terms of resources) between Selector and Earth?

These were matters that were unimportant to the story being told in the series, and were not explained. We do know that X was unaware of the destruction of Selector until the end of episode #103 of the first series, and was apparently unaware of exactly what happened to it. Tatsunoko certainly did not have the notion of an intergalactic war in mind when that was written. That idea was born during the preparations for the second series. James

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I think a Gatchaman/Lovecraft fic would be cool -I hope your "messed up" idea continues! Just imagine, shoggoth mechas...

Yes, well, everything is pretty grim in that idea. The SNT is not quite what it seems, either (poor Ken). Why have mechas if you have shoggoths?

That's an interesting beginning, UW. It does sound dark, but sometimes the dark stories are the best.