This week we are honoring... well, discussing... the New God Phoenix and Pimer, it's Zark-like autopilot. Here is the New God Phoenix. And a more 'menacing'; view of its front. And for some reason, it had a rainbow on its back (goooo 70s designers). However, it could do a mighty fine Firebird. Here is the inside of the New God Phoenix. Notice Pimer in the middle doing the flying. Ryu still got to sit up front, though. Pimer could be out of sight, and when necessary rise up from under the floor and slide along some tracks to the front of the New God Phoenix. And here's a close up of Pimer. He looks like a cross between Zark and a gumball machine. Fortunately, he didn't really have a personality or talk much. Except in one ER episode... but we won't go there. You may all be wondering WTH were the designers thinking? Well, James will elaborate on this I'm sure, but essentially, the sponsors pf the show (including Popy, the toy manufacturer) had a lot of say in the design of these vehicles. They were the ones who liked the bird ship. So you can thank them for all of those lovely Gatch II and F designs.

Pimer??? What??? Ugh....

Oh good lord. If I was a birdie and I saw that ship, I'd demand the old one back or I'd quit. No way in hell I'd fly around in a giant chicken... Yukky yukky ... But, hey. Maybe it was an effective distraction to the Galactor goons. I mean, they'd be uncontrollably laughing their asses off at the ship ... Can't aim properly when you're laughing ... it's much like trying to whistle. SJ

[FONT=comic sans ms]The 1st God Phoenix was the best not the chicken ship hahahahahahha[/FONT]

See - the Flying Chicken is what you get when you contract out to the Government and Committees to build things!

"But, hey. Maybe it was an effective distraction to the Galactor goons. I mean, they'd be uncontrollably laughing their asses off at the ship ... Can't aim properly when you're laughing ... it's much like trying to whistle." HAHA you said it!!! thats gotta be teh reasonign for it! yeah my sister and I coudlnt stop laughing when we saw this mess. bok bok

Does this mean the New God Phoenix was the precursor to Robo Chicken?

Oh, I LOVE Robot Chicken!!!!!

So what was the story line for changing ships?

Ah, so that's the Flying Chicken I have been reading about. Jesus Christ, I thought some of the Mechs and their Captains looked ridiculous.

I notice in the interior shot that Ken and Ryu have changed locations. I always think of Ken on the left as you look into the Command center, no the right. Was it just this image or is he in this position throughout this series?

Originally posted by shamrokchick So what was the story line for changing ships?

It was a new ship for the Gatchaman II series. It was supposed to be an 'upgrade' from the original God Phoenix...

Every time I see that ship I think "Wow, I didn't know turkeys could fly."

Okay, this is my experiment to see if it's possible to improve the appearance of the New God Phoenix by trying to get rid of those damned eyes and yellow beak! (Images from Junsjoint.net's ER section)

I still cringe everytime I see that ship - and the team's mechas for that matter!! I get the whole "giving in to what the sponsor's want" thing, but yeesh! You can still make toys kids will want without making them the laughing stock of the anime genre... And Pilmer... I can't help but shake the thought that that's where Sandy Frank got the idea for Zark... Ok, Pilmer and R2D2.... But poor Pilmer suffers the effects of my dislike for Zark... At least Pilmer was of more use than old Zark ever was! (sorry, Barrdwing. I know you're a Zark fan!) I sometimes wonder what Tatsuo Yoshida would have thought/done with the design direction if he had still been alive... ETA Wow, LB! I would say that makes a HUGE difference! At least that ship would have gotten some respect!!

Wow... I like your improvements LB!

I love those improvements LB! Now that I could almost call a ship - even if it is still not the Phoenix I love.

LB! Nice improvements! Now try it with the Condor Attacker....

Originally posted by Condorfan Every time I see that ship I think "Wow, I didn't know turkeys could fly."

My thoughts exactly, Condorfan! With American Thanksgiving coming up, I'm thinking that ship should be plucked and roasted!

No worries, Hino; I know Zark has got serious flaws. But seriously, can you imagine the disasters if he were flying the ship?

There's not much that can be said in defence of the chicken ship. But I had one, since there was a shop in the city centre where I grew up selling these rebadged as BOTP, and it was a really good toy It could shoot missiles from under the wings, the wings opened up to reveal where 2 of the vehicles went, the front folded up to make the runway for the G1, and there was also a spring loaded pod on the top and a pod at the back for the other 2 vehicles. It even had doubly hinged landing gear.

Originally posted by Barrdwing No worries, Hino; I know Zark has got serious flaws. But seriously, can you imagine the disasters if he were flying the ship?

I think he'd always be in danger of crashing because he'd be Windexing the viewscreen!!!!

I just dont like it, call me old fashioned. Maybe if it had a paint job it would be tolerable..... but dont hold me to that

Originally posted by meridianday There's not much that can be said in defence of the chicken ship. But I had one, since there was a shop in the city centre where I grew up selling these rebadged as BOTP, and it was a really good toy It could shoot missiles from under the wings, the wings opened up to reveal where 2 of the vehicles went, the front folded up to make the runway for the G1, and there was also a spring loaded pod on the top and a pod at the back for the other 2 vehicles. It even had doubly hinged landing gear.

That does sound like fun! Do you ever wish you still had it?

Originally posted by lborgia88 Okay, this is my experiment to see if it's possible to improve the appearance of the New God Phoenix by trying to get rid of those damned eyes and yellow beak! (Images from Junsjoint.net's ER section)

Yep, without those eyes and yellow beak, it does look a bit better but still looks like a blind flying chicken now.

Originally posted by Transmute Jun

Originally posted by Barrdwing No worries, Hino; I know Zark has got serious flaws. But seriously, can you imagine the disasters if he were flying the ship?

I think he'd always be in danger of crashing because he'd be Windexing the viewscreen!!!!

AND talking to Susan on the mobile phone, while plioting. AND telling 1-Rover-1 to stop chewing up the seats. AAAANNNNDDDDD Galactor will be just sitting there just wondering what the heck is going on over there.

Originally posted by lborgia88

Originally posted by meridianday There's not much that can be said in defence of the chicken ship. But I had one, since there was a shop in the city centre where I grew up selling these rebadged as BOTP, and it was a really good toy It could shoot missiles from under the wings, the wings opened up to reveal where 2 of the vehicles went, the front folded up to make the runway for the G1, and there was also a spring loaded pod on the top and a pod at the back for the other 2 vehicles. It even had doubly hinged landing gear.

That does sound like fun! Do you ever wish you still had it?

I haven't got that particular one. But I bought another one since.... The collector in me couldn't let it pass by. Wish I knew where it was now though. I think it's in the attic.

What is areo-dynamic about that beak??? (Ahhh my spelling is shocking today.)

That ship was the scariest thing in the series, except for the Condor Attacker. What on earth were they thinking.

Originally posted by Ebonyswanne What is areo-dynamic about that beak??? (Ahhh my spelling is shocking today.)

Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

Originally posted by clouddancer Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

It's the Blue Hawk. And nope, the Blue Hawk was *far* better looking than the NGP.

Originally posted by Transmute Jun

Originally posted by clouddancer Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

It's the Blue Hawk. And nope, the Blue Hawk was *far* better looking than the NGP.

That is right, the Blue Hawk. But I meant Aerodynamically, The Blue Hawk looks a lot less aerodynamic than the NGP does. Not that the NGP was a better looking ship than the Blue Hawk.

Hi all! Well, I'm certainly not going to try to convince anyone that the New God Phoenix is a better looking ship than the original God Phoenix, because it isn't. I will admit that, over the years, I have gotten used to its design, so it doesn't horrify me anymore. And, you have to admit, it has a lot more character than the Gatcha Spartan does! Anyway, as far as official stats for the ship goes, here's what was written up regarding it in the Gatchaman II Planning: "New God Phoenix Then main mecha that houses each of Gatchaman and the others mecha. (Performance) Engine Equipped with two large rocket engines. Maximum Speed: In the air: Mach 5.0 Underwater: 60 knots Cruising Range 18,000 KM (Functions) It has automated storage equipment, is rigged with radar as well as numerous information systems, and is also able to run underwater. (Armament) Equipped with four 50mm Vulcan Guns. Equipped with 10 rounds of "Bird Missile 2." The "Science Ninpo Firebird" is identical to the previous production; when the limits of the generator are exceeded, it produces intense flames." The New God Phoenix made its first appearance in episode #10 of the Gatchaman radio drama, in a story set between the first and second Gatchaman TV series. In it, once the Science Ninja Team send the original God Phoenix to a watery grave, Dr. Nambu appears in a submarine and takes them to G-Town. Once there, he introduces them to the new God Phoenix. After G-Town surfaces, Nambu orders the Ninja Team out in their new ship, taking it flying into the sky. The next five episode of the series were stories that later appeared in Gatchaman II, so the new God Phoenix was included in all of those. While the New God Phoenix isn't as popular with fans as the original God Phoenix is, the Science Ninja Team members apparently loved the ship, and take some time in the first episode to gush about how wonderful it is. Their reactions come across like people who are seeing the ship for the first time, just like the viewers. This doesn't make a whole lot of sense, since, according to Nambu, they have been continuing their training since Gallactor was first defeated. If they had been training, the appearance of their ship should be nothing new to them. Oh well, that's just a concession we have to make to the fact that it's a new series with new equipment to introduce to the audience. The first episode also contains a bit of information regarding the stats for the New God Phoenix that differ from what was in the Planning. As the ship is launching, the Narrator is telling viewers all it, including that the ship has a maximum speed of Mach 8.5, a full 3.5 Mach faster than what the stats for the ship list. But, since it appeared in the show itself, I'd say it takes precedence over what was in the Planning. Over the course of the series, we learn more about the capabilities of the New God Phoenix beyond what it outlined in the Planning, as well as some of the specialized equipment the ship carries. The hull of the New God Phoenix so strong that the ship can ram it's way completely through the Gallactor base located inside a mountain. If it should lose power to its engines, the New God Phoenix has the ability to glide through the air for distances far in excess of what one would expect (Episode #24). The Planning notes that the New God Phoenix can use the Firebird. We also see that the New God Phoenix can transform into the Firebird both in the vacuum of space and while underwater. When submerged, the field forming the Firebird somehow causes the water to freeze. As with the original God Phoenix, all the Ninja Team vehicles are needed for the New God Phoenix to use the Firebird. Part of the circuit created by these vehicles generates 700,000 volts of energy (Episode #'s 8, 9). The New God Phoenix can also use the Firebird Shadow Separation. The only major change from the Firebird Shadow Separation used in the original Gatchaman is that now there are five individual vehicles for the Science Ninja Team to use, instead of the four that were originally available (Episode #6). A new Ninpo technique involving the New God Phoenix made its first appearance in Gatchaman II -- Science Ninpo Bird Diving. Bird Diving puts the New God Phoenix into an extremely fast dive. The wind resistance this dive generates can be used to force an enemy that is swarming over the surface of the New God Phoenix off the ship. The risks involved with using this Ninpo are that the extreme G-forces created inside the New God Phoenix make it difficult to control the ship, and that the New God Phoenix is in danger of crashing into the ground if the pilot is unable to pull out of the dive in time. (Episode #11) The New God Phoenix can escape Earth's atmosphere and travel in outer space by use of a rocket booster attached to its rear. This booster allows the New God Phoenix to travel safely to the Moon and back (Episode #'s 8, 18, 44). It is well known that the New God Phoenix has hangars for the five individual G-Mecha used by the Science Ninja Team members, but it is often forgotten that it also includes hangars additional vehicles. One of these, the Swan Rocket, is a one-man open air rocket for use in space. It launches from the top of the nose section of the New God Phoenix (Episode #. The other, a submarine with seating for all five Ninja Team members, is launched from the bottom of the ship (Episode #30). The New God Phoenix can also be used to transport the Orbiter G into space for launch (Episode #44). In addition to the commonly used Bird Missiles, the New God Phoenix also carries a Magnetic Missile. This missile, fired from the bottom of the New God Phoenix, generates a powerful magnetic field that can attract smaller metallic object to the missile, carrying them with the missile to its target. The Magnetic Missile has a delayed detonation, allowing it time to attract as many smaller object as possible before it explodes (Episode #11). The New God Phoenix also has a remote flying sensor unit that can fly ahead of it to detect electromagnetic fields that can disrupt the electronic systems on board the ship before the New God Phoenix itself is affected (Episode #24) And if that weren't enough, the New God Phoenix can readily be used as a Bomber, carrying a payload over a target and releasing them from the bottom of the ship (Episode #'s 7, 37). If the need arises to transfer personnel from the New God Phoenix to another ship in flight, the ship is equipped with harnesses to lower two people at a time through a hatch toward the bottom of the rear section of the vessel (Episode #15). One piece of specialized equipment on the ship allows the Science Ninja Team to track the location of any of the individual G-Mecha, as well as identify the ship by its call sign (Episode #10). The New God Phoenix also possesses a sonar probe for detecting movement underwater (Episode #15). Amid all of monitors and sophisticated equipment in the Control Room of the New God Phoenix, one will find a hot-line style telephone, which can be called if someone needs to reach the Science Ninja Team in an emergency (Episode #27). Also, the New God Phoenix has facilities for storing drinks, as Jinpei has been seen holding a drink in the Control Room (Episode #9). Alas, the New God Phoenix met its demise at the hands of Gallactor's Drill Mecha. The ship was badly damaged and shot out of the sky, crashing to the ground below. The Science Ninja Team barely escaped its destruction with their lives (Gatchaman Fighter #1). James

Hi all! Since this week is about more than just the new God Phoenix, let's take a look at Pimer. The comparisons between Pimer and 7-Zark-7 are obvious, since both are R2-D2 inspired robots that appeared in the Gatchaman universe in 1978. It has been suggested more than once over the years that one may have inspired the creation of the other, but the timing doesn't really bear that out. Both characters were being created on opposite sides of the Pacific Ocean at essentially the same time, without either Sandy Frank or Tatsunoko knowing what the other was doing. As fun as it might be to think that there was some sort of mutual collaboration going on, the truth is that both Tatsunoko and Sandy Frank came up with the notion of their robots independently. Regardless, this isn't about Zark, it's about Pimer. Like the New God Phoenix, Pimer made his first appearance in episode #10 of the Gatchaman radio drama. In that story, after the New God Phoenix has been launched from G-Town, Nambu orders everyone to take their new individual G-Mecha out to begin their training. Ryu wonders who will control the New God Phoenix if he leaves, and Nambu introduces him to their Pilot Machine, Pimer. Pimer subsequently had a small role in four more episodes of the series. TV viewers were introduced to Pimer in Gatchaman II #1, when Pimer is raised into the New God Phoenix's Control Room and takes his position manning the control of the ship. When asked why Ryu calls the robot "Pimer," Ryu explains that the name is an abbreviation of "Pilot Machine" Jun thinks this is a cute name. No one asks what Pimer thinks. You may be wondering how "Pilot Machine" becomes Pimer. Well, it actually makes more sense in Japanese than in English. Pimer in Japanese is "Paima," and Pilot Machine is "Pairotto Mashin," hence "Pai" and "Ma." The name "Pimer" comes from the Popy die cast toy of the robot, which had the name "Pimer" in Romaji on the toy. Early American Gatchaman fans latched onto the Pimer name, and it's stuck ever since. Honestly, Pimer doesnt do too much in the course of the series. While listed along with the main cast in the credits of every episode, Pimer only appears in 28 episodes, mostly seen flying the New God Phoenix and saying the occasional "Roger" to orders given to him. Over the course of the series, we learn that Pimer can locate the Ninja Team members via their Bracelets (Episode #2) and that Pimer's palm-sized power unit is located on his back (Episode #24). We also learn that Pimer is adversely affected by magnetic fields (Episode #'s 10, 24, 3. Pimer actually takes on a key role when the Ninja Team uses the Firebird Shadow Separation. When this is done, Pimer remains at the controls of the New God Phoenix, while the members of the Science Ninja Team are in their separate craft. (Episode #6) While it is never officially stated, Pimer was probably destroyed along with the New God Phoenix in the battle with Gallactor's Drill Mecha (Gatchaman Fighter #1). Pimer has the distinction of having been voiced by two actresses. For the first episode of Gatchaman II, Kazue Komiya provided the robot's voice. Beginning with episode #2, Yo Inoue took over the role. Ms. Inoue continued as Pimer through the rest of the run of the series. In a sad note, Ms. Inoue died from lung cancer on February 28, 2003. She may be gone, but she'll always be remembered by Gatchaman fans for her part in the series. James

Thanks for all this great info, James!

Wow, thanks James.

Thanks James!

You know, I recall seeing all of those Gatch II episodes, but when you put all of those abilities of the NGP together it sure is a lot! The ship itself was great, but the appearance of it still makes me shudder.... I recall the phone on the bridge of the NGP. I thought it was hysterical that they had such an outdated communication system! Very reminiscent of the Batphone. I never knew that much about Pimer before! I notice however that unlike Zark, the KNT didn't really seem to have any attachment to him. I guess to them, Pimer was just another piece of the machinery.

Hi all! Okay, a slight update to the previously posted info, now with added pictures that I didn't have time to deal with last night. James

Thanks James for the pictures...

Originally posted by Transmute Jun

Originally posted by clouddancer Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

It's the Blue Hawk. And nope, the Blue Hawk was *far* better looking than the NGP.

I think the Blue Hawk looks better too. But it doesn't seem very aerodynamic. Maybe it's just me, but it seems like the New God Phoenix has a similar body style to it...

Absolutely incredible as usual, James! Thank you!

Originally posted by shamrokchick

Originally posted by Transmute Jun

Originally posted by clouddancer Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

It's the Blue Hawk. And nope, the Blue Hawk was *far* better looking than the NGP.

This is the shot I was thinking of when I said I thought the NGP probably flew better than the blue Hawk. With that nose pointed down to the ground there would be a whole lot of drag on the head of that ship. At least the NGP "beak" did not stick down quite as far.

Originally posted by tatsunokofan Hi all! Okay, a slight update to the previously posted info, now with added pictures that I didn't have time to deal with last night. James

Thanks again James. For those, like myself who have never seen Gatch Ii and F, the info and pics help us to understand this conversation a bit better. Still looks like a flying chicken to me though.

Originally posted by clouddancer

Originally posted by shamrokchick

Originally posted by Transmute Jun

Originally posted by clouddancer Hey it is probably better than that ship the team protects early in the series, when RI first shows up and destroys the ship because it is under Galactor control. Sorry I cannot remember the name of the ship.

It's the Blue Hawk. And nope, the Blue Hawk was *far* better looking than the NGP.

This is the shot I was thinking of when I said I thought the NGP probably flew better than the blue Hawk. With that nose pointed down to the ground there would be a whole lot of drag on the head of that ship. At least the NGP "beak" did not stick down quite as far.

Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Originally posted by Metaliant Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Probably based on a humming bird rather than a Hawk .....

James your vast information and knowledge again is much appreciated. I loved the fact that you added episode numbers in that, so people can look into it more.

Originally posted by clouddancer

Originally posted by Metaliant Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Probably based on a humming bird rather than a Hawk .....

My mind hit the rubber room, when I looked a little to long at that front.

Hi all! Don't forget, the nose of the Blue Hawk straightened out after the plane took off, reducing drag. The basic shape of the Blue Hawk, including the moving nose cone, was based off of the look of the real world Concorde supersonic jet. So, even if it doesn't replicate the Concorde perfectly, the basic design style of the Blue Hawk can fly very, very well. James

Thank you for all the information and pictures James. I think all the capabilities and equipment certainly make the NGP a ship to be wary of even though it does not look "pretty".

Originally posted by clouddancer

Originally posted by Metaliant Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Probably based on a humming bird rather than a Hawk .....

Ha ha... Yeah true... Thanks again James... You're right it does look like it...

Hi all!

There's not much that can be said in defence of the chicken ship. But I had one, since there was a shop in the city centre where I grew up selling these rebadged as BOTP, and it was a really good toy

In case you'd like to see a vintage commercial for that toy, it can be found here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEO1IpTdLlg It's followed by a short commercial for a Starzinger Astrobo toy, then another Gatchaman II commercial, for the Ofuro Set that included a toy of G-Town and a motorized toy of the New God Phoenix, so make sure you watch the full minute's worth of commercials! James

Originally posted by clouddancer

Originally posted by Metaliant Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Probably based on a humming bird rather than a Hawk .....

Maybe it should be called the Blue Humming Bird instead?

Originally posted by Metaliant

Originally posted by clouddancer

Originally posted by Metaliant Judging by the pic, the beak on the Blue Hawk was a bit too long for my liking.

Probably based on a humming bird rather than a Hawk .....

Maybe it should be called the Blue Humming Bird instead?

Maybe they were trying to stick with the Birds of Prey theme.

Originally posted by Transmute Jun I recall the phone on the bridge of the NGP. I thought it was hysterical that they had such an outdated communication system! Very reminiscent of the Batphone. I never knew that much about Pimer before! I notice however that unlike Zark, the KNT didn't really seem to have any attachment to him. I guess to them, Pimer was just another piece of the machinery.

Personally between the two I like Pimer. He just does his job and no long boring monologues. James, thanks again for all your incredible Gatch information. I still say you should write a book! I know this doesn't exactly fit in with this thread but I have to wonder--how did the KNT hear with those helmets? I mean that picture of Ken holding the phone to his helmet doesn't make sense!

Well, three of them had an antenna jutting off of the back and two didn't; I always wondered about that too. Either the antenna was decorative--why?--or there was some reason why Jinpei and Ryu didn't need one. Then there's the scene where we see Jun with wires plugged into the "eyespots" on her helmet. Still trying to figure that one out. I suppose the "eyespots" are really auditory pickups?

If you watch the 60s Batman, Batman puts the Batphone, not at the bat ear at the top of the hoof but just below the ear piece.

Originally posted by Barrdwing Well, three of them had an antenna jutting off of the back and two didn't; I always wondered about that too. Either the antenna was decorative--why?--or there was some reason why Jinpei and Ryu didn't need one.

Is it possible that an artist at Tatsunoko with a fondness for antennae did the initial sketches of Ken, Joe and Jun's helmets, but another artist did Jinpei's and Ryu's? This could explain also why Ryu and Jinpei have non-bumpy but more eye-like spots on their helmets.

My theory about the antenna was that the non comic relief members of the team wore them.

Originally posted by Condorfan My theory about the antenna was that the non comic relief members of the team wore them.

That's it! Ryu and Jinpei needed to be able to fall on their heads without fear of breaking off any antennae!

I think you've got it, LB!!!!!!

* worships James knowledge* If I could find the smiley I would have used that instead! James, you are certainly our Guru of all Things Gatch! But it still looks like a chicken!